The Rhythm of Confession

Several people wanted to talk further about the discipline of confession after the service on Sunday night. Such a powerful gift from God that allows us to continually draw near to the throne of grace, especially after we stumble. We simply need to agree with God about our sin and dive into the forgiveness that surrounds our souls in Christ. In this way, we return to God after pushing Him away and enjoy renewed closeness with Him. What questions or comments do you have about the discipline of confession?

Pastor John

WWJD with Alcohol

Kevin Boyd commented to the post on alcohol as follows:

The only sin I see is the consumption of alcohol that cost less than 3.99 a six pack. Here are some examples: Bud Light, Miller Light, Coors Light... you get the idea. So expand your horizons and find a "good" beer. For you new people venturing away for the first time, try a Sam Adams seasonal. I believe the Summer Ale is in season right now. Have fun and remember, you don't get good at it unless you practice.

Boyd's comment is hilarious and underlines a key issue in this debate. The fact is in John 2, Jesus made wine, lots of wine, at the end of a seven-day wedding when people had already had plenty of opportunities to drink wine. He did so, not so that people would abuse it - though some probably did. He created wine (and tasty wine I am sure) because wine is a drink of celebration and Jesus is all about life. The bible never categorically prohibits drinking alcohol, but it does promote moderation in this and all other areas of life.

Questions: Which is worse for the body and/or soul - gluttony or drinking moderately? Which is a bigger problem in our culture? In the American Church?

I'll be at Four Peaks Brewery Thursday night at 8 if you want to talk more about it. Cheers!

pastor john

What about Alcohol?

I am posting a comment from another thread regarding alcohol and the Christian. I want to hear what all of you have to say on this hot button issue. Sky Parker wrote:

Alcohol consumption... definition of moderation? Should we consume alcohol at all? If so, what moderation is acceptable? What does the Bible say? We know drunkenness is a sin. I pulled the following text out of an online story:

"Church belief concerning alcohol consumption includes three classic positions: abstention, moderation and prohibition. Prohibitionists believe the Bible forbids any alcohol consumption since it is thought to be inherently evil; therefore, any consumption would be immoral.

There is logical inconsistency within this view because whenever wine is referenced negatively in the Bible it is always fermented; however, when it is a positive reference, or consumed by Jesus Christ and the apostles, it is always unfermented. Prohibitionists (almost always) use ad hoc arguments, and distort the testimony of the Bible and antiquity.

Abstentionists believe the Bible does not specifically forbid alcohol consumption, but abstain for the sake of prudence. Certainly some in the church abstain for personal reasons, but it cannot be said such practice is demanded in the Bible.

A common abstentionist myth is regarding the production of wine in the ancient world. One example is the claim that grape juice was often boiled until the liquid evaporated to prevent fermentation. Any grape juice that fermented was always diluted from three parts water to one part wine, or even 20 parts water to one part wine, which would make the alcoholic content negligible. Therefore, wine today is not the same as wine in biblical times.

The truth is some of the wines were stronger in alcoholic content than those today and were best consumed diluted with water. Not only does the abstentionist position distort the historical and linguistic scholarship, but also - and most importantly - the sufficiency of the Bible for faith and practice since it is the extra-biblical conviction of the abstentionist that is authoritative. It is curious that the Bible never makes a distinction between so-called "safe/non-sinful" diluted wines and so-called "unsafe/sinful" undiluted wines, especially when the only biblical reference to diluted wine (viz. by the prophet Isaiah) is a condemnation.

Moderationists believe alcohol consumption is acceptable before God if consumed prudently and moderately. Alcoholic beverages can be and are abused, just as any other good gift from God can be and are abused. Since Satan cannot counterfeit God's good gifts, he will encourage abuse and so seek curse upon it.

However, the command of the Bible is moderation if alcohol is consumed. The church must not belittle the moral responsibility for personal sin by holding something external responsible. Alcoholic consumption may occur in faith and according to the directives of the law of Christ. The matter of alcohol consumption within the limitations of the Bible is simply a matter of discretion and personal taste.

Prior to the 1800s, there was nearly universal agreement by every denomination of orthodox Christianity regarding the moderate consumption of alcohol for health and pleasure. Condemnation of the moderationist position is maintained through the capricious rejection of centuries of church history - and most importantly, the assertions of the Bible - by granting priority instead for an ascetic fundamentalism that is deemed a greater standard of holiness and prudence than the Bible.

The plain teaching of the Bible concerning the moderate consumption of alcohol should promote church integrity and unity rather than spirited disagreement that is often manifested in contention and strife among the body of Christ.

The church's unity in belief and practice must be based upon the Bible solely. To demand abstinence and prohibit moderate alcohol consumption as a matter of faithfulness to God not only conflicts with the biblical and historical record, but also would be indictments upon Old Testament saints, the Lord Jesus Christ, the apostles and unanimity of 1,800 years of church history.

The prohibitionist position that all alcoholic beverages are inherently evil, and that any use is therefore sinful, pronounces a curse upon God's blessing, and regards God's blessing in this matter to be a curse.

The abstentionist position often neglects biblical teaching of maturity and personal responsibility in regard to matters of church liberty. The Bible consistently condemns drunkenness (alcohol abuse) as sin, but never condemns use of alcohol (medicinally or moderately) as evil.

Scripture declares wine specifically is a good gift from God. The Bible and the entire Christian tradition have sternly condemned the sin of drunkenness - as should the church not only in Effingham, but also anywhere in the world.

As a component of God's creation, alcoholic beverages are something that may be enjoyed to the glory of God in moderation for both health and pleasure and with a thankful heart.

Ron J. Bigalke Jr. (M.Apol., M.Div., M.T.S., Ph.D.) is an author, lecturer and pastor. He is director of Eternal Ministries Inc. based in Rincon."

I personally like to enjoy a dark, red, non-fruity glass of wine with dinner occasionally or a dark, oatmeal stout with a burger "in moderation for both health and pleasure and with a thankful heart"

What do you think?

Why Pray Anyway?

Hey everybody:

The following are my comments to a post on prayer. I would love to hear your thoughts.
Pastor John

Anonymous said...

Dear Poiema,

I have a burning question that I have been wanting to ask you . . . Prayer . . . Why do you pray? If God know what the future holds then why? I know the main foundation of prayer is that it is our way of talking with Him, communing with Him and keeping that intimate relationship open. Though where I seem to falter is when a person is ill and people gather in pray what good are we actually doing. If God is all knowing then wouldn’t he already know if that person lives or dies, does God ever take into consideration our prayers and our wishes? And if not then why do we pray for other people and ourselves?

June 10, 2008 8:45 AM

Poiema Pastor said...

This is a very good and highly practical question. I think we have to begin by asking "what is prayer?" At its core, what is the essence of prayer? Thoughts?

pastor john

June 10, 2008 10:24 AM

Anonymous said...

Pray at its core is to worship God and to meditate on Him and what he does for us. I believe in miracles and I believe that pray can help. It is God’s will that we pray and keep the faith by praying for the hungry and the poor. Maybe praying is not so black and white but a middleman to be with God and to do God’s will.

June 11, 2008 11:49 AM

Poiema Pastor said...

I agree. Prayer is fundamentally our life line with God. Prayer is the means by which our soul communes with Him. This is why the Lord's Prayer (a model prayer outline in Matthew 6) focuses on our union with God and submission to Him. Sometimes it is easy to reduce prayer to communicating our wish list to God. We can start to think that if God doesn't answer a particular prayer as we would like, then He must not be listening, doesn't care, or that our prayers are meaningless. I find it interesting that Jesus promises that God answers every prayer with a resounding "yes" (see Matthew 7:7-11). The challenge for us to receive His answer, even when His "yes" doesn't match up with ours.

The longer I walk with God, the more I understand that His will and purposes are best for me. Therefore, even when I don't get the "result" from prayer that I might have desired, I know that my prayers are always effective in drawing me closer to the Lord and cultivating God's will in my life.

Much more to say on the topic. I'll stop for now.

The Jesus Revolution

He caused a massive spiritual earthquake that altered the landscape of the spiritual realm and reshaped eternity itself. It was the greatest revolution of all time. All other revolutions must be measured against the revolution brought by the Son of God when He who left heaven to seek and destroy the works of the devil, that He might seek and rescue those under sin's rule. Through His perfect life and sacrificial death, Jesus Christ, the greatest of all revolutionaries, disarmed the evil one, ended his reign of terror, and declared victory over the darkness by condemning the sin that once condemned us.

This Sunday we will discover the Jesus revolution comes with an invitation for us to rise above the fall and taste real life - fully human life. Every political coup or struggle for freedom and power betrays the human longing for the freedom, peace and community that only our Champion could bring. He conquered the sin that drives our selfishness, greed and discontent. He invites us now to encounter a revolution of the soul; and to embrace the privilege of advancing His unstoppable revolution that will one day fill the earth. Interested? See you Sunday morning at 10am

pastor john

iTouch - the Gospel and Social Justice

Poverty, AIDS, Homelessness - What would Jesus do? What has Jesus done? What should we do in light of what He has done?

This Sunday, we ponder the priority of social justice as followers of Jesus. Is the gospel identical to social justice? Is social justice an add-on to the gospel? Some over-spiritualize the gospel and make it all about heaven and hell. Others under-spiritualize the gospel and make it all about ending oppression in the present. But the gospel is about now and then. It is deeply spiritual, yet full of grit. A proper understanding of how the gospel fuels social justice will challenge and invigorate you to give yourself away for Him.

In Matthew 23:23, Jesus paraphrases Micah 6:8 to summarize God's Great Commandment expectation upon our lives. Using this OT passage as a guide, we will examine what it means for us to "do justice," "love mercy," and "walk humbly with our God." We will find that loving the Lord our God with all our heart, soul and mind, and loving our neighbor as our selves means living out the justice, mercy and humility of Micah 6:8. It means viewing all human beings as God does - created in His image with inherent value as His image bearers.

Jesus calls us to action, not merely to doctrine. He compels us to follow Him in incarnating the gospel to a world in desperate need of His present and future work on our behalf. As we put legs on the gospel and serve those in need, we encounter more fully what Jesus has done for us, even as we glorify God by serving others who reflect His image, and give them an opportunity to embrace the gospel by touching us as we touch them.

I am looking forward to a powerful time together with Him.
pastor john

Can I lose my salvation?

I am responding to the following anonymous post:

Thanks for your message on Sunday, John. It was a great reminder that God had planned all along to use weak and frail humans to bring about His purposes for creation. As you were speaking, I couldn't help but think of the many verses that seem to indicate the seeming possibility of failure for the Christian (warnings in Colossians 1, Revelation 2-3, the whole book of Hebrews). How do the truths of God's purposes to perfect us and bring us into the conformity of the image of Christ coincide with the repeated warnings to persevere in the faith or face possible rejection? (Also, if you could give your thoughts on how final judgment fits into this that would be great!)

Great questions "Anonymous." I will try to answer these questions briefly but clearly. I am sure I will not be able to answer you completely in a single post, but I will give it a shot.

The Bible teaches clearly and consistently that once God makes us His through faith, we are His for eternity. After all, our salvation is initiated and completed by God, not us. Once we are His, we are His forever because He is the one who makes us His and guarantees our eternal destiny with Him. Romans 8:28-30 describes our certain hope in Christ:

“And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose. For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren; and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified.” (Romans 8:28-30)

These verses reveal the glorious, unbreakable chain of salvation, which God initiates, secures and consummates in this irreversible, divinely guaranteed chain of events. What God begins, He brings to completion without exception (Phil. 1:6; 1 Thess. 5:24). So certain is our future with God that Paul speaks of us in Christ as "having been glorified" in the past tense, just as we were justified (entered salvation) in the past tense through faith. But how can our future in Christ be spoken of in the past tense? Because our future with Christ is just as certain as our past in Him. This is why we (with imperfect faith) can rest in God's perfect salvation - it doesn't depend on us. It depends completely upon Him, the one who grants us faith and salvation (Eph. 2:8-10).

Now, what about verses which seem to imply that someone who is once in Christ can again be lost? All such verses, including those you listed in your post, do not teach that you can lose your salvation or hand it back. Instead they exemplify the doctrine known as the perseverance of the saints. This Biblical doctrine teaches that those whom God has claimed for himself will prove that they belong to Him by persevering in their God-given, God-sustained faith to the end (Matt. 24:13). This does not mean true believers will not stumble, have doubts or go through dry spiritual seasons. It does mean God guarantees that of those the Father gives the Son, He loses not one (John 6:35-44). Furthermore, 1 John 2:19 affirms that those who abandon the faith after apparently believing never really believed: "They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.

Let's look at the passages you mentioned one by one:

Colossians 1:21-23 says:

21And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, 22he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him, 23 if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

In this long, run-on sentence, Paul makes a conditional claim about genuine believers. The if clause in verse 23 is the hinge of the passage. Grammatically speaking, it could just as easily have been placed before verse 22. Either way, this final verse (clause) is the condition upon which the promises of (20-22) are based. In other words, Paul says, "if indeed you continue in the faith, you are now reconciled, etc." When Paul; says “if,” he uses a grammatical construction that infers “and I fully expect that you will” since you are, after all genuinely reconciled in Christ. This passage proclaims the eternally secure hope that every genuine believer in Christ enjoys - a hope based upon our transformation in Christ that is complete according to 2:8, 10 and guaranteed according to 3:1-4. Thus, 1:23 should be understood in this context as well. In Colossians 1:10, they are to walk in a manner worthy of their secured position in Christ (cf. Eph 4:1). See also Ephesians 1:13, 14; 4:30 for Paul’s teaching on the perseverance of the saints in the same context.

Paul affirms with Jesus that only those who endure to the end are genuinely saved, (Matt. 24:13). That is, genuine children of God will persevere to the end. In Colossians 1:21-23, Paul is saying: all these things area irrevocably true of you, if indeed you are genuinely His. And the way that you know if you are genuinely His is by continuing in faith: 1. As one who has been well founded, that is securely established as the foundation of a well built home would be. It is interesting that this verb is in the passive voice, emphasizing that the genuine child of God has been "done to" by God—that is, God has established Him firmly and this is His hope.
2. As a steadfast or unwavering person, that is, not shaky, but firm. This person is one who is not continually be moved away from the hope of the gospel, but instead is continually moving toward faith and spiritual maturity in Christ (1:9-12). Lifestyle is at question here.
Those who you have become a partakers of the gospel are irrevocably His—this is our hope!


The Book of Hebrews rehearses the same doctrine throughout its pages. The author is writing to a group of Jewish Christians that had been infiltrated by certain Jews who claimed to be part of Christ's Body but who were really "professing pretenders." They claimed the name of Christ but they were still clinging to the Old Covenant sacrificial system. They had not, therefore, believed in Christ unto salvation. The author of this letter warns over again that genuine believers in Christ will forsake the old covenant and persevere in truth until the end:

Hebrews 3:6 ... Christ is faithful over God’s house as a son. And we are his house if indeed we hold fast our confidence and our boasting in our hope. - In other words, if we persevere in faith, we prove that we are His workmanship.

Hebrews 3:14 ...For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end. - Again, we have come to share in Christ if the power of Christ within us compels us to hold on to Him.

Hebrews 3:19 (the author compares this NT audience to the OT Jews who wandered in the desert in their unbelief and never entered the promised land, saying: we see that they were unable to enter because of unbelief. The issue is not one of losing salvation, but of never obtaining it!

Salvation in the Book of Hebrews is described in terms of entering God's rest. In Hebrews 4:1 ... Therefore, while the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us fear lest any of you should seem to have failed to reach it (enter salvation). Again, the issue is not one of being in then out, but of never entering God's rest (salvation) in the first place.

In Hebrews 6:1-8, the author gives his harshest warning yet to the pretenders in this community of faith who were still insulting the blood and grace of Christ by practicing the old covenant sacrifices:

1Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2and of instruction about washings, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3And this we will do if God permits. 4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. 7For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. 8But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned.

Note especially verses 4-8. If these apostate non-believers continue falling away from God in their unbelief, resisting the enlightenment of the Holy Spirit and the power of God's Word that is calling them out of the Old Covenant and into the New, they would become unsavable! Verse 6 says they are approaching a point of no return in their rebellion against God and were about to commit what I believe is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit (See Matthew 12), which boils down to a bold-faced rejection of the gospel by non-believers who never belonged to Christ. Verse 8 says they were almost cursed and about to be burned. They were at the very last stage of apostasy!

In Hebrews 6:9, the author assures the genuine believers in the audience that they he believed better things for them, things that accompany salvation - affirming once again that the warnings above apply to professing pretenders who were not yet saved.

The section in Hebrews 10:19-39 follows the same pattern, concluding with a similar encouragement to the genuine believers: 39But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls.

I would be happy to respond to the Revelation passages if you could be a bit more specific as to which passages you have in mind.

In response to your question about final judgment, the Bible speaks of two judgments at the end of the age:

1. The white throne judgment (Rev. 20:11-15) determines who is in Christ and who is not. Those whose names are written in the book of life will be forever with God in the new heavens and earth. Those without Christ will be separated from God forever in hell.

2. A judgment of works for believers in Christ (1 Cor. 3:10-15; 2 Cor. 5:10). At this judgment, the deeds of our life in Christ are sifted by God's holiness to determine their origin and subsequent value. Those things done in the Spirit will last forever and we will enjoy them forever. Those things we did of ourselves will be lost forever.

I hope this helps. Thoughts or questions anyone?
pastor john